Home › Forums › Help/Technical Questions › Values and types of caps in triangle Big Muff?

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  • October 20, 2009 at 10:59 am #79152
    devnulljp
    Participant

    I have a triangle Big Muff that some idiot (EDIT: apparently I’m the idiot here…:-)has filled with 1 uF electrolytic caps. It works but doesn’t sound that great. I figure I need to replace all the caps. But what types? Ceramic? Metal film? POLYSTYROL? Metallized Film ? Something else? The ones in my good muff are ceramic discs I think…the dodgy one has electrolytics of allthe wrong values (curse you ebay!)

    This is what I’m working from
    7.gif

    This is my dodgy Big Muff: All those electrolytics that look out of place are 1uF picard.png

    18b92ea9.jpg

    This is my good Big Muff

    17581ba2.jpg

    I noticed there’s a cap down the bottom left next to the diodes that’s 0.5 uF in the scheme above, but 0.1uF in my good muff (and 1uF in my dodgy one).

    Here’s the schematic I’m looking at too

    th_circuit.gif

    October 20, 2009 at 11:14 am #102441
    The EH Man
    Moderator

    That “idiot” you refer to is the factory employee that assembled your pedal. Those are original caps and contrary to what any of the so-called “Big Muff gurus” might say, 1uf caps were used in early 70’s Big Muffs as well. I have one with 1uf caps (and have personally repaired others) and I far prefer it to any of the .1 cap units.
    There are also at least 3 resistors different in your “dodgy” pedal. Oh no!!! Better replace them so it matches the “good” one, too!

    As I’ve said for years, there is NO one schematic that will match all Big Muffs. They used whatever they had on hand at the time that would work. That is what adds to the beauty and mystery.

    I’d replace the caps with new 1uf caps as they are probably leaky after 30+ years of use. I’ve seen them go bad in later Big Muffs. They’ll definitely play havoc with the sound if leaking.

    October 20, 2009 at 11:28 am #102442
    devnulljp
    Participant
    Quote:
    That “idiot” you refer to is the factory employee that assembled your pedal. Those are original caps and contrary to what any of the so-called “Big Muff gurus” might say, 1uf caps were used in early 70’s Big Muffs as well. I have one with 1uf caps (and have personally repaired others) and I far prefer it to any of the .1 cap units.
    There are also at least 3 resistors different in your “dodgy” pedal. Oh no!!! Better replace them so it matches the “good” one, too!

    As I’ve said for years, there is NO one schematic that will match all Big Muffs. They used whatever they had on hand at the time that would work. That is what adds to the beauty and mystery.

    I’d replace the caps with new 1uf caps as they are probably leaky after 30+ years of use. I’ve seen them go bad in later Big Muffs. They’ll definitely play havoc with the sound if leaking.

    Really? It’s stock? The whole thing looks to have been banged together by someone in a hurry, and it doesn’t sound good at all (which is why I compared it with the other one, which sounds great; it’s also why I called it dodgy, It sounds like a big wet blanket over the speaker, and has no volume to speak of. This is the one I was planning to send you to repair but it looked like I’d figured out why it sounds so bad. back to the drawing board I guess. I’ll pop it in the mail to you to have a look at).
    Those 1uF electrolytic caps look a lot newer than anything else on that board too. I figured the guy I bought it off had just shoved in whatever he could find lying around to get a signal and then punted it.
    The pots aren’t original either (they’re just standard pots jerry rigged onto the board). Neither is the wiring. Or the switch. I don’t think it’s a stretch to think some caps are non-original either considering how much else of the pedal has been munged.

    October 20, 2009 at 12:03 pm #102443
    Ned Flanders
    Moderator

    Ron is right…but typically what I’ve seen is all caps are 100nF ceramics. 100nF= 0.1uF.

    I also agree that big muffs with 1uF sound waaaaaaaaay better,the 100nF caps just dont suit it IMO and that’s why I hate stock sovteks.

    I wouldn’t be surprised if them pots are original, in fact it wouldnt surprise me if the entire pedal was 100% original!

    Fact is some big muffs sound like shit,some sound mediocre and some sound great, some are biased correctly and some are slightly gated, there’s so much variation its no wonder collectors have so many.

    And the schematics,even EHX factory schematics I have aren’t 100% reliable because the builder could have like he done in your pedal put in different values than the schematic states.

    99% of big muff schematics online are from one guy who traced HIS one pedal,it doesnt mean ALL big muffs are the same as HIS. I really only trust genuine EHX schematics and then the pedal can differ from them anyways.

    October 20, 2009 at 12:17 pm #102444
    devnulljp
    Participant

    Thanks for the replies guys. Although whether muffs with 1 or .1uF caps do or don’t sound good is beside the point here, as this muff doesn’t sound that great…certainly not as great as it should sound…and has been butchered in its day. I’d like to return it to whatever former glory it once had. It should sound fekking great, but it doesn’t. Those caps looked like the most obvious choice for parts that might be responsible for the poor sound. Apparently I’m wrong, which still leaves me with a bad sounding muff I’d like to get working properly.

    EDIT: I doubt if it’s stock. It’s got shielded cable and a crappy cheap modern 3PDT switch. It’s definitely been hacked together. One of the drawbackss of ebay…

    October 21, 2009 at 6:54 am #102469
    Ned Flanders
    Moderator

    Switches and wire aside,all those caps(even the electro’s) and resistors,transistors look completely stock to me.

    I’d swap the electro’s for new ones,could very well be the problem.
    Also,like I said,some big muffs DO sound like shit,its just a fact!

    October 22, 2009 at 7:29 pm #102543
    devnulljp
    Participant

    Caps were toast (crumbled when I touched them). Replaced with the same values and it’s all good.
    Cheers

    October 22, 2009 at 8:49 pm #102545
    Ned Flanders
    Moderator

    What ones exactly?

    October 22, 2009 at 9:05 pm #102548
    devnulljp
    Participant

    This one was the worst — it was pretty much wire and dust.

    18b92ea9-1.jpg

    October 22, 2009 at 9:15 pm #102549
    Ned Flanders
    Moderator

    That’s odds for ya!LOL
    An electro will normally go well before a ceramic cap. My Mustang still has the 50nF/50volt cermic tone cap it came with in 1966 and it still sounds great!

    November 16, 2009 at 11:15 pm #103826
    devnulljp
    Participant

    Hey, does a 0.2uF cap in that position seem odd? My others have 0.01 and 0.05uF caps there.

    November 17, 2009 at 2:02 am #103835
    Ned Flanders
    Moderator

    Not at all…we’re talking about old EHX here remember, there was zero consistency from time to time.

    I have a V5 and all the caps are the correct value but totally different types than others I’ve seen, I’ve seen ramsheads with all CC resistors or just one, I’ve seen triangles with only a few ceramic caps,the rest greenies.

    You have to expect variation with vintage EHX, its not really a problem anymore though as all pedals are pretty much identical nowadays.

    Today the only reasons any two big muffs of identical model would sound different is transistor hfe and component tolerances as all value/parts are selected (and PCB’s populated) by machines not by hand so they get it right all the time. But, machines cant match tolerances,well they can but EHX don’t.

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