Home Forums Ideas / Suggestions / Feedback The Small Stone needs a facelift

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  • #77791
    mhammer
    Member

    There is much to like in the classic Small Stone, but there is so much more to mine in the basic design. Those of us who have tinkered with the basic circuit have found so many more sonic options in it. From vibrato, to Leslie-type ramp-up/ramp-down options, to Uni-Vobe adaptations, to my personal favourite: the phasefilter (based on John Blacet’s old Phase-Filter module for synths).

    With just a couple of extra toggles, the basic Small Stone can be transformed until you can barely recognize it. So why keep it harnessed as a one-knobber any longer?

    While we’re at it, how about a simple 4/6/8 stage option?

    #93857
    julian
    Moderator

    cool idea

    #93904
    puretube
    Member
    Quote:
    There is much to like in the classic Small Stone, but there is so much more to mine in the basic design. Those of us who have tinkered with the basic circuit have found so many more sonic options in it. From vibrato, to Leslie-type ramp-up/ramp-down options, to Uni-Vobe adaptations, to my personal favourite: the phasefilter (based on John Blacet’s old Phase-Filter module for synths).

    With just a couple of extra toggles, the basic Small Stone can be transformed until you can barely recognize it. So why keep it harnessed as a one-knobber any longer?

    While we’re at it, how about a simple 4/6/8 stage option?

    Mark: currently, the most advanced “Small Stone” is vibe-able,
    has 2 variable delaylines in it`s feedback-loop so it can go through zero,
    and some more…
    the prototype was labelled: “Stoned Missus” – “Flaser/Phanger”, for obvious reasons :D

    stomi087.jpg

    now its aka: “Flanger Hoax”

    #93916
    BlueSteel
    Participant

    Cool idea, but like puretube said, theres already the flanger hoax, which i think could get all of those noises you were talking about. i have one, and it makes some crazy sounds! :)

    #93922
    John J
    Member

    Still, it would be interesting to see something Small Stone-sized with the vibrato toggle, 3-way stage select and perhaps an expression pedal jack like the Polyphase.

    The Flanger Hoax is just recently starting to get the attention it deserves, but I’m confused as to why it took so long. It’s been available for what, five years? As far as I know, it’s one of only TWO analog thru-zero flangers on the market (not to mention the Foxrox is twice the price, and super rare because it has been temporarily OOP for a good long while) and it is literally the only box available that can make those sounds. Here’s some Flanger Hoax love comin’ at you, Puretube!

    #93923
    mhammer
    Member

    Though I personally don’t consider it a criticism or shortcoming, just about every review I’ve seen of the Flanger Hoax depicts it as “deep”, implying that achieving a desired tone is not a simple matter, and almost demanding a more seasoned user. Certainly not as simple a matter as the good old “one-knobbers” (Small Stone, Doctor Q, Y-Triggered Filter, Small Clone, etc). And even though in a just world it shouldn’t have, I think that seems to have held it back in terms of sales. That’s just my opinion, though.

    What I’m proposing for the Small Stone lies somewhere between the Flanger Hoax, and where the Small Stone is now. I’m thinking simple modulation box with just a few more tricks up its sleeve. There are all sorts of 3-knob phasers out there (Speed, Depth, Resonance), and with a digital implementation, Boss introduced Barber-pole phasing for the masses. But no one has ever produced a commercial Phase-filter effect from what I know, and for such a delightful signature sound it is such a simple thing to do on a Small Stone. The use of OTA stages provides some really nice easy-to-implement options, like converting stages from allpass to lowpass, staggering notches, and so on.

    What else might the typical Small Stone owner/user like? Some kind of stereo output might be nice (e.g., an extra 90 degrees of phase shift for output 1 relative to 2), as would a vibrato option. And finally, for my money, a centering control (that shifts the overall range of where the notches are, without altering sweep width) would be delightful. So, two knobs (Rate, Center), a Color switch, Vibrato switch, Phase-filter/phaser switch, and a stereo output option of some kind, would give a great many players a wider palette to draw from than before. All of it still providing the same classic SS sound people have come to love. And if you want to throw in a ramp-up/ramp-down switch, there’s “that” market too.

    But, but, but…you say…..we MAKE a fancy phaser already: the Polyphase! Yes, you do, and a fine phaser it is. But, there are some things it doesn’t do. And, if EHX can have more than one distortion, and more than one delay, and more than one chorus, it can have more than one or two phasers that each do different things, and appeal to different markets. Besides, if one already owns a few phasers, and has experimented with them in series or parallel, you’ll know there can be some really interesting sounds produced by having two of them at different speeds doing slightly different things.

    #93932
    puretube
    Member

    From vibrato to phaser to filter (+ tremolo)
    is what I did in the (non-OTA…) “Wahbrato”-labelled prototype… :

    dustywahbrato.jpg

    now its aka: “WORM”

    (…but I fully understand what you`re trying to explain –
    some “Small sTon plus” (OTA-based) indeed is to be found in some of my 7 or 8 year old vaulty files)
    ;)

    BTW.:

    my initial prototype did have a “center-control” and a “dry/wet”-blend… :

    WAHBRATO2.jpg

    #93947
    BlueSteel
    Participant
    Quote:
    And, if EHX can have more than one distortion, and more than one delay, and more than one chorus, it can have more than one or two phasers that each do different things, and appeal to different markets.

    I totally agree with that.

    #93950
    mhammer
    Member
    Quote:
    From vibrato to phaser to filter (+ tremolo)
    is what I did in the (non-OTA…) “Wahbrato”-labelled prototype… :

    dustywahbrato.jpg

    now its aka: “WORM”

    I haven’t actually played a Worm, yet, so I ask a naive question: Does it actually DO the phase-filter thing? That is, 2 stages allpass, followed by 2 stage lowpass? If you’ve never tried it (though somehow I doubt that could ever be :-) ), its a wonderful swampy thing. Cancel the dry signal so that you only get the allpass/lowpass signal and its this gorgeous combination of vibrato, modulated wah and quasi-tremolo that, at medium speed, has voodoo written all over it. It’s a sound that deserves to be heard more often.

    #93956
    imalways
    Member

    How exactly is the “wahbrato” stacked?
    I think it would sound best Trem>Filter>Phase.

    Thus the filter opening and closing with the speed of the trem, and finally treated with phase in/out.

    Just my humble opinion.

    #93961
    puretube
    Member
    Quote:
    How exactly is the “wahbrato” stacked?
    I think it would sound best Trem>Filter>Phase.

    Thus the filter opening and closing with the speed of the trem, and finally treated with phase in/out.

    Just my humble opinion.

    There`s no “stacking” of effects happening in the WORM;
    its the variable combination of it`s building blocks
    that let it do either this or that…

    #93963
    puretube
    Member
    Quote:
    I haven’t actually played a Worm, yet, so I ask a naive question: Does it actually DO the phase-filter thing? That is, 2 stages allpass, followed by 2 stage lowpass? If you’ve never tried it (though somehow I doubt that could ever be :-) ), its a wonderful swampy thing. Cancel the dry signal so that you only get the allpass/lowpass signal and its this gorgeous combination of vibrato, modulated wah and quasi-tremolo that, at medium speed, has voodoo written all over it. It’s a sound that deserves to be heard more often.

    I`m not aware of how THE phasefilter thing sounds (though I`ve read Mr. Rossum`s, and Mr. Colin`s teachings),
    but there indeed is a chance I have come through similar sounding effects when experimenting with the 6-stage pure tube apparatus which the discrete transistor Wahbrato is a souped-down clone of:

    T-WAHBRATO2.jpg

    there are a lot of possibilities of interactively combining those stages…

    #93987
    imalways
    Member
    Quote:
    Quote:
    How exactly is the “wahbrato” stacked?
    I think it would sound best Trem>Filter>Phase.

    Thus the filter opening and closing with the speed of the trem, and finally treated with phase in/out.

    Just my humble opinion.

    There`s no “stacking” of effects happening in the WORM;
    its the variable combination of it`s building blocks
    that let it do either this or that…

    So the “Wahbrato” is very literally the EHX Worm then?

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