Home › Forums › Help/Technical Questions › Tap/Clock input device for Super Pulsar
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March 16, 2020 at 2:15 pm #125932Flick (EHX Staff)Moderator
Just curious, is the Super Pulsar’s TAP footswitch working normally at the moment?
Let me know what happens when changing back to External Switch mode and trying the Time Bandit’s internal tempo setting with the Super Pulsar.
March 16, 2020 at 3:03 pm #125933OkuloParticipantYes, the tap function is working fine.
I set the Super Pulsar to External Switch and it is ‘working’ again in that it is picking up the tempo from the what is set manually on the Time Bandit; i.e. it slows down and speeds up. However, if I set it to, say, 120bpm and my Zoom R24 to 120bpm and start playing with a Zoom R24 drum track, within a minute, the Super Tremolo is out of phase with the drums. If I use the Click-in to the Time Bandit from the R24, it seems to go out of phase much quicker.
That was with a clean signal at 120bmp. Unfortunately for me, when I get going with what I’m trying to achieve (a sweeping helicopter sounding choppy rhythm via a deluxe Big Muff with expression pedal), I tend to play with the tremolo rather than the drums and it gets pretty messy in a quarter of the time. Although the Mod Rex is better for synching, for some reason, the tremolo wave does not sound as square as the Super Tremolo otherwise, I’d consider giving up trying with the Super Tremolo.
March 16, 2020 at 4:03 pm #125934Flick (EHX Staff)ModeratorIf you remove the Super Pulsar and replace it with the Mod Rex, with the same connections to the Time Bandit, does the Mod Rex follow along with the R24 perfectly?
March 16, 2020 at 4:15 pm #125935OkuloParticipantI haven’t tried that as yet because the Mod-Rex has a dial in tempo which matches the R24.
I’ll try it soon, though.
March 17, 2020 at 12:10 pm #125938OkuloParticipantUnfortunately, having tried using my Mod-Rex with the Time Bandit, I am now very confused; partially down to terminology and abbreviations but mainly due to not doing very well at school (probably).
I get that click-in is the opposite (as far as this is concerned) of clock-in, so it is unhelpful for me that the Super Pulsar and Mod-Rex have TAP/CLK IN and CLK/FC options whilst the Time Bandit says CLICK IN.
So, I assume that Tap, Foot Controller and Click all equate to the same thing and that I the Mod-Rex should be set to -FC-, which appears to have been its default.
The Mod-Rex manual (p14) says that in this mode, it expects a TRS cable but the Time Bandit instructions state that a mono cable should be connected to the out jack (in fact, they state that both output and input are mono.
In any case, I tried the Mod-Rex with the Time bandit using a TS cable (I haven’t got a TRS handy). Before connecting, I set the Mod-Rex to 40bpm and connected the Time Bandit at its default 120bpm and waited for something to happen but the Mod-Rex LED just carried on flashing at 40bpm.
If the Time Bandit output is TS, I’m not sure if it is worth going far out of my way to get a TRS cable but I will have a good rummage later.
By the way, just for good measure, I tried the Mod-Rex set to CLOC too.
March 17, 2020 at 1:35 pm #125939Flick (EHX Staff)ModeratorThanks for trying the Time Bandit with the Mod Rex. It sounds like you did everything correctly.
I apologize for all the confusion around the terminology used between the various manufacturers here.
The Time Bandit’s CLICK IN expects an audio signal (a signal that goes positive and negative equally around 0V), presumably one that is or sounds like a metronome. The Time Bandit’s output mimics a switch being pushed and released.
The Super Pulsar and Mod Rex expect either a switch connection (this is the type of connection the Time Bandit outputs) or a clock signal which is a third type of signal that is neither an audio signal or a switch signal but instead is a more like a digital logic signal that is either on or off and switches from 0V to some higher voltage, perhaps 5V.
The Super Pulsar can handle switch signals when it is set to External Switch or it can handle a clock signal when set to CLOCK IN. The Mod Rex can handle either signal at all times.
The Mod Rex can accept TS cables, you are not required to use a TRS cable with the Mod Rex.
The Mod Rex will only update its tempo display when its set to CLOC mode.
Do you by any chance have a footswitch accessory that could be used to test the TAP/CLK IN jack on the Super Pulsar or the CLK/FC jack on the Mod Rex.
I have to say, after reading your posts, it seems very possible that the Time Bandit is not working properly. Or the cable connected to the Time Bandit’s output jack is no good.
March 17, 2020 at 3:25 pm #125941OkuloParticipantThanks for the reply.
Well, the thing is, the Time Bandit does affect the speed of the Super Pulsar. If I tap a slow tempo on the Super Pulsar and then connect the Time Bandit, it will respond and oscillate at the Time Bandit tempo, albeit with the problem there is that there is drift and as I mentioned, it is out of phase with the drums after a short time. But it does output something which the Super pulsar responds to.
However, the Mod-Rex does not respond at all. If there is a problem with the Time Bandit, it isn’t that there isn’t recognisable output.
Regarding the cable, I might not have a TRS cable at hand but I have plenty of TS cables and I don’t think that is the problem.
AT THIS POINT, I decided to run through everything again to make sure that what I have just typed is correct, and it was, but then I disconnected the cable from the Time Bandit and must have shorted the connections with my fingers as the Mod-Rex suddenly set itself to 498bpm (I don’t know what that says about my central nervous system!). Having seen this response, I reconnected the Time Bandit and the Mod-Rex tempo switched to 119bmp (the Time Bandit was set to 120bpm). From this point, all the adjustments made on the Time Bandit affect the Mod-Rex but are surprisingly consistently 1bpm slower – I thought that if anything, a discrepancy would be proportional.
If I set the Time Bandit to 30, the Mod-Rex remains at whatever tempo it was previously at, other than that it is consistent:
TB 31, MR 30
TB 70, MR 69
TB 200, MR 199
All the way to the Time Bandit maximum of 299 and the Mod Rex is 298.
Armed with this unfortunate information, I just spent several brain frying minutes with each device trying to figure out which, if any, actually stays in synch with the drums or each other by watching the LED flashes and they all suck and all but one of them, if not all of them (I’m counting everything including the R24), is gaining or losing by about a second every 16 minutes, by my rough estimation. I think my first digital watch in 1975 was more accurate – even the cheapest modern digital watches have an accuracy of ~2 seconds per day.
Anyway, at this point, I don’t see how a solution could be possible and I literally have a headache so I’m going to take a break from it.
Thanks for your help.
March 17, 2020 at 3:32 pm #125942Flick (EHX Staff)ModeratorI’m sorry we haven’t been able to solve this problem.
March 17, 2020 at 3:37 pm #125943OkuloParticipantNo worries. If a solution does present itself, I’ll share it here.
March 17, 2020 at 7:17 pm #125944Flick (EHX Staff)ModeratorQuote:No worries. If a solution does present itself, I’ll share it here.That would be great, thank you.
March 17, 2020 at 9:37 pm #125945OkuloParticipantSorry, I just can’t leave this alone.
Would it be possible to synch with a drum machine by connecting the tip of a TRS to MIDI pin 5 and forgetting about using the Zoom R24 as a drum machine?
I was thinking of a Boss DR-880. I used to have one but found it more than I needed and traded down to a DR-3 but that doesn’t have MIDI out?
Or are there any other drum machines which you think might synch? Ideally, I’d have a drummer who kept time with me/the Super Pulsar but that isn’t a realistic possibility.
March 17, 2020 at 11:41 pm #125946OkuloParticipantPlease disregard my last post, I think I’ve found the solution.
The Time Bandit is unnecessary complication.
Everything I have read about using click in which mentioned the audio level has said to set it as high as necessary and as the Zoom R24 default click output is at 50%, I had been experimenting between 50% and 100% to the Time Bandit and very often, it started flashing red to reset the synch but it was picking up the click and to some extent passing it on to the Super Pulsar. When I connected the Super Pulsar directly to the Zoom R24, I had played around with the same range of audio output settings and sounds, mainly ‘stick’ and ‘click’ as they seem to have the most square shape. It sounded okay to me, listening in on a parallel pair of headphones but the Super Pulsar LED flashed in synch for a few beats and then flashed extremely fast for a second.
Anyway, I had the brainwave rather than go for maximum audio level, experiment at sub 50% and found that at 20%, the synch was solid. I rigged everything up to play what I am trying to achieve and played for 12 minutes without the slightest slippage – so I think that was the answer, I’m relieved to say.
March 18, 2020 at 1:25 pm #125947Flick (EHX Staff)ModeratorGreat to hear! Thanks for the feedback and now we now the Super Pulsar can handle an audio click. Do you have the Super Pulsar set for Clock In when connected to the R24?
March 18, 2020 at 3:35 pm #125948OkuloParticipantSorry, that was quite stupid of me not to say and to be honest, I wasn’t even thinking about it so I had to go back and check by switching modes to see how the Wave Invert LED flashed. Anyway, it is in External Switch mode.
I should also add that I had been monitoring the click in a parallel pair of headphones using a Y connector which was a bit ungainly so I removed it and the level was obviously affected so I have had to tweak the click output from the R24 again and there seems to be a short period each time that the Super Pulsar goes a bit rogue but once it settles down, it has so far been quite solid.
January 13, 2022 at 2:35 pm #186848martin aleksandrovParticipantHi Okulo,
I am also looking forward to test the clock sync, did it finally work for you?
Martin
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