Home › Forums › Help/Technical Questions › 8 Step Program MIDI issues.
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April 26, 2013 at 8:33 am #82963dBVelocityParticipant
So I am running the 8 Step Program into my Moogerfoogers (CV out to freqbox ‘frequency input’ with ‘osc out’ direct to a midimurf for tonal and rhythmic shaping) and attempting to use CC midi control from an Evolution UC-33e and I find that when the 8 step first powers on, it responds to the controller just fine up to so many messages and then it doesn’t seem to respond to midi any more unless I reboot. This happens pretty much 10/10 times. It works fine at boot up and then suddenly stops responding to messages as though it has a small midi buffer that is easily overwhelmed. Any one else verify this or is my unit showing signs of defection?
Otherwise the on board controls work great and I love this pedal for making my other pedals shine like a modular synth. Couldn’t get that level of control before at such a great price. Just disappointing that the midi keeps failing. Any help is appreciated, thank you.
April 26, 2013 at 1:10 pm #118965Flick (EHX Staff)ModeratorQuote:So I am running the 8 Step Program into my Moogerfoogers (CV out to freqbox ‘frequency input’ with ‘osc out’ direct to a midimurf for tonal and rhythmic shaping) and attempting to use CC midi control from an Evolution UC-33e and I find that when the 8 step first powers on, it responds to the controller just fine up to so many messages and then it doesn’t seem to respond to midi any more unless I reboot. This happens pretty much 10/10 times. It works fine at boot up and then suddenly stops responding to messages as though it has a small midi buffer that is easily overwhelmed. Any one else verify this or is my unit showing signs of defection?Otherwise the on board controls work great and I love this pedal for making my other pedals shine like a modular synth. Couldn’t get that level of control before at such a great price. Just disappointing that the midi keeps failing. Any help is appreciated, thank you.
We haven’t seen this problem where it stops responding to MIDI data in our tests of trying to overload it with MIDI data. Which CC(s) are you using? Which channel do you have the 8-Step set to?
You could try a factory restore, this is on page 19 of the manual. Doing this will erase any presets you might have made.
The most likely problem might actually be something wrong in the hardware, in the MIDI circuit.
April 27, 2013 at 1:19 am #118966dBVelocityParticipantWell I have tested several scenarios now: changing midi ch of controller and 8 step, using specific CC’s and PC messages with each boot up, performing factory restore and swapping with other midi control devices.
With the Evolution controller, the 8 step mostly failed when sending CC’s over knobs and faders to control rate, depth, glide and step slider values but also occurred when sending CC 34 assigned to a button to toggle start and stop after many presses and another assigned to CC 118 with various values for preset load. The 8 step continued to act normal on boot up and eventually got stuck each time, all without ever rebooting the controller.
I then used a Roland EF-303 as a controller with the main knobs set to send CC’s for Rate, Glide, Depth and Expression ’24, 25, 28 and 4 respectively’ and set step length as the expression control selected.
These knobs all worked well without trouble with the exception of Rate control (24) which was only able to control when setting expression control (4) to the rate setting. I never encountered an issue with midi start/ stop/ reset messages (not CC form but midi standard messages) but then I decided to set the 8 step pattern length to 1 and assign my EF-303 step modulator to CC 16 as to obtain a midi controlled 16 step sequence, this did not work great as I hoped and most (95%) values sent were ignored.I then swapped to a Roland MC-50 sequencer as the main controller. All midi standard start, stop and reset messages worked beautifully. I then created events in the sequencer for standard program change messages and located the events at around 50 ticks before each measure change. This was about 80% successful for the first 5 min and then became worse as I went along where it would even sometimes change to different programs than triggered.
All in all, I’d say the midi on my unit is not solid except when using standard start, stop and reset messages. I can continue testing more scenarios but it’s getting quite upsetting and I’ll likely be sending it in. This was my first EHX pedal and it hasn’t been the most pleasing experience as expected but I won’t hold it against the company too hard.
April 29, 2013 at 5:25 pm #118984Flick (EHX Staff)ModeratorWe are conducting some tests using Ableton Live at the moment, sending out a continuous stream of multiple CC messages to the 8 Step.
When you use the hardware controllers, are you occasionally moving sliders, knob and buttons, like one every other second or slower or are you constantly moving multiple sliders?
April 29, 2013 at 6:46 pm #118985dBVelocityParticipantQuote:We are conducting some tests using Ableton Live at the moment, sending out a continuous stream of multiple CC messages to the 8 Step.When you use the hardware controllers, are you occasionally moving sliders, knob and buttons, like one every other second or slower or are you constantly moving multiple sliders?
In most of these cases I have been sending isolated messages and even at slow tempos as you say and particularly in the case of the MC-50. The midi clock sync is spot on but messages other than standard transport ultimately get lost..It’s also worth noting that I’ve swapped several midi cables to rule that out as a factor.
I use to own a Behringer FCB1010 midi foot controller board which I wish I could plug up at this time to see how well that would integrate but as I said my 8 step is being returned. I am looking to exchange it in hopes that I’ll have better luck. Then maybe a second 8 step if all goes well.
Bonus Tip to others reading:
I do like using it as a pseudo LFO (Glide:9 for Triangle wave/ 0 for square, Last Step:2, Slider 1:0 Slider 2:127 Depth and Rate:as you desire) :coolsmile:April 29, 2013 at 6:50 pm #118986Flick (EHX Staff)ModeratorIs the 8 Step syncing to MIDI clock through all these failures?
April 29, 2013 at 8:59 pm #118990dBVelocityParticipantQuote:Is the 8 Step syncing to MIDI clock through all these failures?The UC33e does not have a clock output so there was none during my early tests with that. The 8 step did however continue to respond to clock output during the other tests/message failures.
April 30, 2013 at 1:29 pm #119006Flick (EHX Staff)ModeratorWe’ve been slamming an 8 Step with around 64 CC messages per second for the past 18 hours and it hasn’t crashed or frozen, so I think your unit has a hardware problem. Although the fact that it continues to respond to MIDI clock after it stops responding to MIDI CC is a little puzzling. We’re going to spend more time on this today.
April 30, 2013 at 2:30 pm #119009dBVelocityParticipant” the fact that it continues to respond to MIDI clock after it stops responding to MIDI CC is a little puzzling.”
To say at the very least. I will be sending the unit to you guys directly and maybe you can confirm that I’m not crazy. I understand how controllers can sometimes skip values in messages sent being encoder based but I don’t get this level of error with my other gear. Sounds like your stress test is going well and I wish you luck. I also greatly appreciate your cooperation and the fact that you are taking a deeper look into possible flaws, it’s quite reassuring.
April 30, 2013 at 2:43 pm #119010Flick (EHX Staff)ModeratorQuote:” the fact that it continues to respond to MIDI clock after it stops responding to MIDI CC is a little puzzling.”To say at the very least. I will be sending the unit to you guys directly and maybe you can confirm that I’m not crazy. I understand how controllers can sometimes skip values in messages sent being encoder based but I don’t get this level of error with my other gear. Sounds like your stress test is going well and I wish you luck. I also greatly appreciate your cooperation and the fact that you are taking a deeper look into possible flaws, it’s quite reassuring.
I just sent a PM to you, please check it before packing up the 8 Step. Thank you for your patience and helping us understand this problem.
May 10, 2013 at 6:43 am #119045rmaxwellMemberI’m having a similar issue. My 8 Step works just fine so long as I use the control panel. It does not respond to MIDI commands other than Clock. I’ve run several tests, for example sending a PC on the same channel as several other devices and all the other devices take the command just fine, but the 8 Step does not respond. Actually, it will randomly, and only very occasionally, start flashing the current preset number, but it will not actually load anything, and there appears to be no consistent rhyme or reason as to when this will happen. Most of the time is simply does not respond. Worse for me is that no one (stores) in Phoenix, AZ seems to have one yet – at least that I am aware of – so I cannot easily get hold of another to check that it’s just a fluke with the unit I got from Sweetwater. Any help on this would be great. I love the concept of this box but without the MIDI functions it doesn’t serve my needs. Is there an easy way to swap the one I have for another than is confirmed to respond fully to MIDI? Thanks in advance. Hoping to hear back for you all. -Max
May 14, 2013 at 1:42 pm #119050Flick (EHX Staff)ModeratorQuote:I’m having a similar issue. My 8 Step works just fine so long as I use the control panel. It does not respond to MIDI commands other than Clock. I’ve run several tests, for example sending a PC on the same channel as several other devices and all the other devices take the command just fine, but the 8 Step does not respond. Actually, it will randomly, and only very occasionally, start flashing the current preset number, but it will not actually load anything, and there appears to be no consistent rhyme or reason as to when this will happen. Most of the time is simply does not respond. Worse for me is that no one (stores) in Phoenix, AZ seems to have one yet – at least that I am aware of – so I cannot easily get hold of another to check that it’s just a fluke with the unit I got from Sweetwater. Any help on this would be great. I love the concept of this box but without the MIDI functions it doesn’t serve my needs. Is there an easy way to swap the one I have for another than is confirmed to respond fully to MIDI? Thanks in advance. Hoping to hear back for you all. -MaxCan you give us some examples of the PC message numbers you are sending to the 8 Step? From the factory, the 8 Step has presets in locations 0 through 9, which would be PC messages 1 through 10 for most MIDI devices. If you send a PC message for an unsaved preset location, the 8 Step ignores the message. Try sending PC #101 while the 8 Step is running, does the 8 Step pause or does it reset to Step 1 and keep going? Does it not do anything at all? If PC #101 pauses the 8 Step then add 1 to each PC message number in the 8 Step’s PC message table, on page 23 of the 8 Step’s manual.
Also the 8 Step must be set to the MIDI master’s MIDI channel so double check the 8 Step is set to the correct MIDI channel. Look to Page 20 of the manual for instructions on changing the MIDI channel.
May 18, 2013 at 5:49 am #119059rmaxwellMemberI’ve tried PCs 0-9 and none of them pause or stop the 8-Step. It will blink the current preset but it will not actually change its behavior. PC101 has the same effect. No reset, no stop, just keeps going. MIDI channel confirmed to be the same on the 8-Step and the controller sending the PC. Also tried several MIDI channels as well just to be sure. Always the same result.
May 19, 2013 at 12:19 am #119061nullinMemberQuote:I’m having a similar issue. My 8 Step works just fine so long as I use the control panel. It does not respond to MIDI commands other than Clock. I’ve run several tests, for example sending a PC on the same channel as several other devices and all the other devices take the command just fine, but the 8 Step does not respond. Actually, it will randomly, and only very occasionally, start flashing the current preset number, but it will not actually load anything, and there appears to be no consistent rhyme or reason as to when this will happen. Most of the time is simply does not respond. Worse for me is that no one (stores) in Phoenix, AZ seems to have one yet – at least that I am aware of – so I cannot easily get hold of another to check that it’s just a fluke with the unit I got from Sweetwater. Any help on this would be great. I love the concept of this box but without the MIDI functions it doesn’t serve my needs. Is there an easy way to swap the one I have for another than is confirmed to respond fully to MIDI? Thanks in advance. Hoping to hear back for you all. -MaxI have the EXACT same problem! And I also got my pedal from Sweetwater as soon as they were in stock. I didn’t notice a problem a first because it syncs to clock perfectly along with my other devices. I noticed the lack of control yesterday. I’ve tried PC changes and CC changes. Occasionally, and seemingly randomly, after sending multiple PC signals in a row (ie stomping the switch) it will flash the current preset number but actually does change to the other preset, but it doesn’t change number. I’m using preset 0 as all sliders down, and preset 1 with sliders 1 and 5 all up to give a pulsing downbeat. Usually, however it does nothing. I also really do need the full MIDI functionality. Is it a bad batch, or are all the 8 Steps like this? I’d also just be up for an easy swap as well. I was going to call on Monday too as I need this resolved. Thanks!
Mike
May 21, 2013 at 1:28 pm #119082Flick (EHX Staff)ModeratorWe have now been able to replicate the problem. Thanks to nullin for help with this. Now we’re trying to figure out what the cause(s) of the missed MIDI messages are.
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