Home › Forums › Help/Technical Questions › Nano Switchblade Channels Mixed??

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  • June 8, 2011 at 2:14 pm #81673
    Damage Inc.
    Participant

    Hello,

    recently I decided to find a simple channel-switcher for my dual-channel but completely switchless amp.
    I ran into the EHX Nano Switchblade, a simple straightforward line-switcher, passive, true bypass(?), compact, not expensive, etc…
    So I bought it, finally received it, but was instantly disappointed because of the following:

    The way this switch is set up between my other gear is rather simple:
    Guitar > Switch Input Y
    Output A > Amp Input 1
    Output B > Line 6 DM4 > Amp Input 2

    First of all, it works, it switches, so it does what it’s supposed to do.
    However, I noticed that, when I played on Channel A, which goes directly into the clean input 1,
    I would hear this slight overdrive, as if you’re playing on a distorted sound with the volume of the guitar only slightly open.
    First I though, well, maybe the amp’s channel-volume is a little high so it distorts the sound.
    But when I turned it back, it kept the same sound and resulted in lower volume only.
    I checked some other volume-knobs, although there isn’t much to check for the rest.
    So then, still on Output A, when I turned off the Line 6 Distortion Modeler, which only runs on the Output B of the Switch,
    the sound coming out of Channel 1 of my amp, which comes from Output A of the Switch, was suddenly clean.
    So, for some reason, when it’s switched to Output A, there is still signal coming from Output B.

    Why can I hear/know this?
    Well, my older amplifier, as explained, has 2 channels/pre-amps/inputs and no switch-mechanism,
    which basically lets you hear anything that’s put into the 2 inputs simultaneously.
    So also when there are 2 signals coming from the Switchblade.

    Is this supposed to happen and if not, what can I do about it?
    Now, even though with this product I was promised a switch, even with true-bypass, it does not deliver.
    I can still not do what I was expecting to be able to do.
    Because when I use one output, the other output is still slightly active.
    And in this case it causes to “dirty up” my clean channel, which is obviously not the meaning.

    Otherwise I could of course still try to use my extra channel as some sort of extra sound for my Distorted channel,
    as I can of course turn on and off that Line 6 distortion pedal.
    But it eliminates the purpose of having a separately shaped clean channel,
    rather than just a clean channel set to make a good distortion-sound for when the distortion-pedal is active.

    Thanks for reading.

    June 8, 2011 at 5:34 pm #115464
    Cryabetes
    Participant

    no offense intended here
    but the extent of the circuitry involved in the switchblade consists of a switch.
    pretty much anyone can make one. assuming you can wrap wires tightly enough around the little prongs on jacks, you don’t even need solder to make one [although solder certainly would be advisable].

    so I’m kind of really doubting it’s the switchblade just because there’s really nothing to them.

    Can you do me a favor to test if it is the switchblade? plug a tuner in [or something with a ‘signal’ indicator] where your DM4 is in the signal chain, but don’t plug it into the amp

    it’ll go
    [guitar]->[switchblade]{outputA} -> amp
    [switchblade]{outputB} -> tuner

    with this setup, when the guitar is going into the amp, the tuner should be picking up just ground noise [you know where it fluctuates between A# and B, like when just a cable is plugged in] or nothing at all.
    If it’s not, then yeah, it’s the switchblade.

    otherwise your amps inputs may be connected. test this by plugging the tuner’s input into the second channel’s input [with the guitar->switchblade out A-> amp thing still going]. If, when playing, the tuner picks up notes, your amps inputs are connected.

    I don’t know how handy with a drill and soldering iron you are, but if your amp’s inputs are connected, you can get around this hassle by replacing the switch in the switchblade with a 3PDT and drilling two more spots for jacks in it. Let me know if you’d want more info on this.

    edit: actually you’d only need one more jack.

    June 8, 2011 at 7:49 pm #115466
    Damage Inc.
    Participant

    I’ll try all that later on.

    But isn’t it clear when I actually HEAR the DM4 (taking the signal from Channel B)
    through the sound of the OTHER signal (fed from/through Channel A) that you hear them not actually separated?
    I mean, it might not be common that you have 2 instrument-inputs on an amp and also both always hot.
    But if you switch between 2 signal-paths on a device, they should definitely be completely isolated from each other.

    I’m also not sure what you mean by if the inputs of the amp are connected.
    All I know is that you can only hear them simultaneously, you can’t turn them off or anything except for the volume.
    But they are parallel because you can turn each down without affecting the other.

    June 8, 2011 at 7:55 pm #115459
    Cryabetes
    Participant
    Quote:
    I’ll try all that later on.

    But isn’t it clear when I actually HEAR the DM4 (taking the signal from Channel B)
    through the sound of the OTHER signal (fed from/through Channel A) that you hear them not actually separated?
    I mean, it might not be common that you have 2 instrument-inputs on an amp and also both always hot.
    But if you switch between 2 signal-paths on a device, they should definitely be completely isolated from each other.

    I’m also not sure what you mean by if the inputs of the amp are connected.

    right, i’m saying that since they’re both ‘on’ all the time, that there might be signal from one going out the other, and the two signals would have to eventually meet at the power amp. It’d work like that since a wire is not a one-way street [yeah transistors are but just bear with me]. are you following my train of thought here?

    June 8, 2011 at 8:06 pm #115460
    Damage Inc.
    Participant
    Quote:
    Quote:
    I’ll try all that later on.

    But isn’t it clear when I actually HEAR the DM4 (taking the signal from Channel B)
    through the sound of the OTHER signal (fed from/through Channel A) that you hear them not actually separated?
    I mean, it might not be common that you have 2 instrument-inputs on an amp and also both always hot.
    But if you switch between 2 signal-paths on a device, they should definitely be completely isolated from each other.

    I’m also not sure what you mean by if the inputs of the amp are connected.

    right, i’m saying that since they’re both ‘on’ all the time, that there might be signal from one going out the other. It’d work like that since a wire is not a one-way street. are you following my train of thought here?

    I think so.

    So that there’s a little bit of signal going through the cable attached to Channel 2 on the amp?
    But wouldn’t that mean it’s leaking from the B-Output on the switch?

    Otherwise I’m not sure how there could be signal going somewhere through the amp
    coming from the channel the switch-pedal isn’t feeding.
    Because it has to go through the distortion-pedal which comes AFTER the switch,
    which should be “dead” if the switch is on A.

    June 8, 2011 at 8:23 pm #115458
    Cryabetes
    Participant
    Quote:
    Quote:
    right, i’m saying that since they’re both ‘on’ all the time, that there might be signal from one going out the other. It’d work like that since a wire is not a one-way street. are you following my train of thought here?

    I think so.

    So that there’s a little bit of signal going through the cable attached to Channel 2 on the amp?
    But wouldn’t that mean it’s leaking from the B-Output on the switch?

    It would if it was, say, a Boss LS-2 or other ‘powered’ switching mechanism.
    But the switchblade is passive- it’s all hardware. it literally is the same as pulling the cable out of your amp channel A and popping it into the DM4 when you hit the switch [albeit much faster than a human could pull off].

    Quote:
    Otherwise I’m not sure how there could be signal going somewhere through the amp
    coming from the channel the switch-pedal isn’t feeding.
    Because it has to go through the distortion-pedal which comes AFTER the switch,
    which should be “dead” if the switch is on A.

    you ever hear the story of how David Gilmour got the seagull sounds on ‘Echoes’? had his wah plugged in backwards?
    that’s kind of similar to what I’m thinking is happening here.

    tl;dr version of what I’m thinking is happening:
    The signal is going in on channel 1 and going until it hits something polar [that is, passes signal in one direction only- a diode, certain types of capacitors, some types of semiconductors] or until it hits a resistor that has a higher resistance than its signal amplitude [volume].
    now, normally, that wouldn’t really matter but I’m thinking channel 2 meets up with it before anything that would prevent the signal from backtracing. So not only is channel two an input, it’s an output, like on a DI box. That second channel input-output is going out into the DM4. Most pedals, again, wouldn’t matter because there’s something polar stopping backtraces into it- however distortion pedals use two diodes [a clipping stage] that are connected to the ground portion of the pedal. The diodes are attached to a resistor but not a big enough one that it’s preventing signal from coming back in [yielding distortion]
    which is then being sent back into the amp from the same direction it came.
    all in a matter of milliseconds.

    which I why I hypothesised that plugging a tuner input into the second channel’s input would result in the tuner picking up the signal.
    What’s the amp, out of curiosity?

    June 8, 2011 at 9:58 pm #115451
    Scruffie
    Member

    Try that debugging first but it IS however possible that the switch in the Switchblade is dodgy and that’s why you’re getting bleed, switches are mechanical and prone to failure.

    June 9, 2011 at 12:19 am #115453
    Damage Inc.
    Participant
    Quote:
    right, i’m saying that since they’re both ‘on’ all the time, that there might be signal from one going out the other. It’d work like that since a wire is not a one-way street. are you following my train of thought here?

    you ever hear the story of how David Gilmour got the seagull sounds on ‘Echoes’? had his wah plugged in backwards?
    that’s kind of similar to what I’m thinking is happening here.

    tl;dr version of what I’m thinking is happening:
    The signal is going in on channel 1 and going until it hits something polar [that is, passes signal in one direction only- a diode, certain types of capacitors, some types of semiconductors] or until it hits a resistor that has a higher resistance than its signal amplitude [volume].
    now, normally, that wouldn’t really matter but I’m thinking channel 2 meets up with it before anything that would prevent the signal from backtracing. So not only is channel two an input, it’s an output, like on a DI box. That second channel input-output is going out into the DM4. Most pedals, again, wouldn’t matter because there’s something polar stopping backtraces into it- however distortion pedals use two diodes [a clipping stage] that are connected to the ground portion of the pedal. The diodes are attached to a resistor but not a big enough one that it’s preventing signal from coming back in [yielding distortion]
    which is then being sent back into the amp from the same direction it came.
    all in a matter of milliseconds.

    So, from the DM4, it sends a bit of signal back into the Channel B of the Switchblade
    and it comes along with the signal that goes through Channel A?
    I did read before buying that it acts in two ways, so maybe it’s because it can do that, that is happens.

    Quote:
    which I why I hypothesised that plugging a tuner input into the second channel’s input would result in the tuner picking up the signal.

    OK, I will try the tuner-test, but to be sure, that would be:
    Guitar > Switchblade
    Output A > Amp Channel 1
    Output B > Tuner > Amp Channel 2
    Correct?

    Quote:
    What’s the amp, out of curiosity?

    The amp is an old LabSeries L7.
    Not sure if you know it, but it’s this 4×10 100W transistor-combo.
    I read once that it was manufactured or owned by Gibson or something.

    June 9, 2011 at 3:50 am #115516
    Cryabetes
    Participant

    no
    the guitar to the switchblade is right
    and out A of the s.b. to the amp channel 1 is right
    but then channel 2 of the amp to a tuner
    nothing should be plugged into out B of the s.b.
    honestly you could probably just test it without the s.b. at all.

    November 25, 2011 at 3:21 pm #116398
    Mr. ORANGE
    Member

    HI, so how were the results ??? Because I have the very same problem…

    From the switchblade I go (A) – through some stuff (FuzzFactory, Tuner, Wah/Volume) to the normal channel on my AC30 and (B) – through the Deluxe Memory Boy to the Top Boost channel…I wanted it to switch channels and assorted effects in the signal path…

    But there’s the exactly same bleed-through ! I only noticed it because my normal channel is getting delay repeats from the DMB even though it’s not in it’s signalpath and therefore it shouldn’t get any. I have got both my channels on crunchy setting so I can’t hear it any other way…I know I could just turn the DMB off and engage it only when needed but I really want to switch from the normal channel with the FuzzFactory to Top boost channel + delay in one step, so I don’t want any bleedthrough !

    Do you have any solutions ? Cryabetes, you thought it could be some other effect pedal causing the signal to stream back ? Maybe it could be the tuner or the Wah/Vol pedal…I’ll try it without them ASAP…

    Thanks for the answers…

    March 26, 2015 at 12:19 pm #120607
    ufna
    Member

    I have the same issue with my Switchblade nano :( Unfortunately signal from Y goes into both channels. It’s quiet, but this mix can be noticeable in some cases.

    August 15, 2018 at 8:31 am #124189
    CrashDelta
    Participant

    I’m having the same problem, I’m running my guitar into Y and then from A and B into two separate amps. When I’m switched into the clean amp, what I’m playing is bleeding through into my dirty amp — it’s not just ground noise. It was like this fresh out the box. I saw a video on youtube on how to fix this, the guy said it was wired wrong, but now I can’t find it again. Does anyone know where to find a blueprint (I’m guessing ‘blueprint’ isn’t the right word, but whatever…) for this pedal? Or does anyone know how to wire it right?

    August 15, 2018 at 2:06 pm #124190
    EHX STAFF
    Keymaster

    Please contact the techs at info@ehx.com 9-5pm NYC time.

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